Frankfurt instead of Bonn

[David T]

In choosing a capital for the Federal Republic of Germany after World War II, Frankfurt was in many respects the logical choice. Economically, it was a major center of commerce, transportation, and manufacturing. Politically, it had been the place where Holy Roman Emperors had been elected, and was the site of the assembly which tried to unify Germany in 1848; more recently, it had been the seat of "Bizonia," the merger of the American and British occupation zones. Culturally, it was the birthplace of Goethe (though of course Bonn had Beethoven). In fact, maybe Frankfurt was *too* logical a choice; choosing it would seem to indicate that the Federal Republic as a West German state was considered permanent. Bonn seemed more obviously a "provisional" capital. (Note that the Federal Republic's constitution was called a "Basic Law" rather than a constitution, and stated that it would cease to have effect when the entire German people could adopt a new constitution.) Of course, another (maybe the main?) reason Bonn was chosen was stated very simply by Lucius Clay: "Frankfurt was so logical...except that Mr. Adenauer loved the Rhine. Period." http://books.google.com/books?id=5HVmAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA409

Had Frankfurt been chosen, the only historical effect I can think of is that it is uncertain (though still likely) that the capital would have been moved to Berlin after reunification. The vote in the Bundestag on moving the capital to Berlin was a fairly close one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decision_on_the_Capital_of_Germany I am not sure, had the issue been one of moving the capital from Frankfurt to Berlin, it would have carried. (BTW, Willy Brandt caused some controversy during the debate by saying that after France had been liberated it would have been unthinkable to keep Vichy as the capital...)

 

[New Yorker]

Hi. This is a subject that has interested me. I believe that we have had a thread on this before. Perhaps someone can find it?

 

[Zelda]

I don't think the government would have moved back to Berlin, ever. But Germany would have still have reunited.

 

[GDIS Pathe]

well I guess holding Fulda just became much much more important with the capitol of FRG at stake

 

[Anderman]

I don't think the government would have moved back to Berlin, ever. But Germany would have still have reunited.

The government most likely not but the President his office and some maybe some federal courts would move to Berlin.
I think it would be awesome if the parliament would meet in the Pauls church were the constitution of 1848 was writen.
I like the symbolic of it.

 

[James G]

I thought Bonn was chosen over Frankfurt on purpose so that it would never become 'the' capital: that was always Berlin to Germans.
In addition, the first chancellor Adenauer had a connection to Bonn as well IIRC.

 

[Anderman]

I thought Bonn was chosen over Frankfurt on purpose so that it would never become 'the' capital: that was always Berlin to Germans.
In addition, the first chancellor Adenauer had a connection to Bonn as well IIRC.

True another reason for Adenauer was that the americans had their HQ in Frankfurt and that was to close for his liking.

 

[James G]

True another reason for Adenauer was that the americans had their HQ in Frankfurt and that was to close for his liking.

Bonn was in the British Zone though and he didn't like Britons!

 

[Anderman]

Bonn was in the British Zone though and he didn't like Britons!

The HQ of the brits was first in Bad Oeynhausen and then several other german cities but not in Bonn.

 

[TwisterAce]

I wonder how making Frankfurt the capital of the FRG would affect Soviet military strategy in the event of a NATO-Warsaw Pact war. As GDIS Pathe pointed out, it would be more important for NATO to hold the Fulda Gap because it leads straight to Frankfurt. Then again, Frankfurt was already a major target in OTL: aside from being the financial capital of West Germany, it was also home to Rhein-Main Air Base (which would have been the primary gateway for American troops and supplies being airlifted into Europe) and the headquarters of the U.S. Army V Corps; the HQ of U.S. Army Europe was also located in nearby Wiesbaden. Making the city the political capital of the FRG would increase its importance to be captured/neutralized by the Soviets, but perhaps not by much.

 

[Seandineen]

The price of Bonn not Frankfurt was a return to the Weimar flag as opposed to adopting Bavaria or the old imperial red white and black.

 

[Mech]

well I guess holding Fulda just became much much more important with the capitol of FRG at stake

The entire point of watching the Fulda gap was to protect Frankfurt in the first place in the event the Soviets did attempt a fast land invasion as it was the most logical route. there were 2 others seen as plausible but far less likely, one in the North German plains, and the other was a possible route in the Danube river valley coming up from Austria, though this one in particular was seen as very unlikely.

Keep in mind Frankfurt wasn't *just* the Financial heart of West Germany, it also housed the largest US airbase in Europe and was the backbone of receiving any US reinforcements in the event the Soviets tried to overrun the area.

 

[New Yorker]

The price of Bonn not Frankfurt was a return to the Weimar flag as opposed to adopting Bavaria or the old imperial red white and black.

I've never heard that the flag had any role in this question? Surely there never was any talk of returning to the white/red/black or adopting the Bavarian flag for the whole of Germany?

 

[Apollo 20]

I think there were two other things going on that led to the selection of Bonn. The first was a fear of Frankfurt becoming too dominant and perhaps entrenching itself as a permanent capital. The hope existed, even then, that Berlin would become the capital of a reunified Germany sometime in the future. The second was pretty simple: Bonn was on the other side of the Rhine from the Soviets and in a better strategic position than Frankfurt. There was also a political component: Adenauer's CDU/CSU wanted Bonn and the SPD wanted Frankfurt. Adenauer won that battle.

Bonn was a sleepy place, full of government offices and embassies and little else. It was said that Bonn stood for Bundeshauptstadt ohne nennenswertes Nachtleben. (Federal capital without noteworthy nightlife)!

 

[JackLumber]

I've never heard that the flag had any role in this question? Surely there never was any talk of returning to the white/red/black or adopting the Bavarian flag for the whole of Germany?

I could see the Weimar flag having a kind of failed state stink on it while the old imperial flag belonged to a more respectable European power, so perhaps that but I don't see the Bavarian flag being seriously considered.

 

[David T]

I could see the Weimar flag having a kind of failed state stink on it while the old imperial flag belonged to a more respectable European power, so perhaps that but I don't see the Bavarian flag being seriously considered.

There is no way the Allies would allow the adoption of the black-white-red flag which was associated with monarchists and the far right under the Weimar Republic. Indeed, it was never seriously considered: "While there were other suggestions for the new flag for West Germany,[52] the final choice was between two designs, both using black-red-gold. The Social Democrats proposed the re-introduction of the old Weimar flag, while the conservative parties such as the CDU/CSU and the German Party proposed a suggestion by Ernst Wirmer, a member of the Parlamentarischer Rat (parliamentary council) and future advisor of chancellor Konrad Adenauer. Wirmer suggested a variant of the 1944 "Resistance" flag (using the black-red-gold scheme in a Nordic Cross pattern) designed by his brother and 20 July co-conspirator Josef.[53] The tricolour was ultimately selected, largely to illustrate the continuity between the Weimar Republic and this new German state. With the enactment of the (West) German constitution on 23 May 1949, the black-red-gold tricolour was adopted as the flag for the Federal Republic of Germany.[5]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Germany

The Allies had fought two wars with Germany, not just one (and of course in the case of France there was the Franco-Prussian War as well) and while they were willing to recognize that the Kaiserreich had been less evil than Hitler's Reich, they sure as heck did not regard it as a good thing--or as superior to the republican traditions (dating back to Frankfurt 1848, not just the Weimar Republic) embodied in the black-red-gold flag. And indeed to some extent the black-white-red flag bore the stigma of the Nazis as well as of the Kaiserreich, since from 1933-35 the Nazis had reintroduced it as a German national flag (coexisting with the Nazi party flag).

I would note that adoption of the black-white-red-flag would be a priceless propaganda gift to the GDR which could claim it was the only true inheritor of German republicanism, and that the West was dominated by the far right, as shown by its flag. But that's academic, because such adoption was not going to take place.

 

[JackLumber]

There is no way the Allies would allow the adoption of the black-white-red flag which was associated with monarchists and the far right under the Weimar Republic. Indeed, it was never seriously considered: "While there were other suggestions for the new flag for West Germany,[52] the final choice was between two designs, both using black-red-gold. The Social Democrats proposed the re-introduction of the old Weimar flag, while the conservative parties such as the CDU/CSU and the German Party proposed a suggestion by Ernst Wirmer, a member of the Parlamentarischer Rat (parliamentary council) and future advisor of chancellor Konrad Adenauer. Wirmer suggested a variant of the 1944 "Resistance" flag (using the black-red-gold scheme in a Nordic Cross pattern) designed by his brother and 20 July co-conspirator Josef.[53] The tricolour was ultimately selected, largely to illustrate the continuity between the Weimar Republic and this new German state. With the enactment of the (West) German constitution on 23 May 1949, the black-red-gold tricolour was adopted as the flag for the Federal Republic of Germany.[5]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Germany

The Allies had fought two wars with Germany, not just one (and of course in the case of France there was the Franco-Prussian War as well) and while they were willing to recognize that the Kaiserreich had been less evil than Hitler's Reich, they sure as heck did not regard it as a good thing--or as superior to the republican traditions (dating back to Frankfurt 1848, not just the Weimar Republic) embodied in the black-red-gold flag. And indeed to some extent the black-white-red flag bore the stigma of the Nazis as well as of the Kaiserreich, since from 1933-35 the Nazis had reintroduced it as a German national flag (coexisting with the Nazi party flag).

I would note that adoption of the black-white-red-flag would be a priceless propaganda gift to the GDR which could claim it was the only true inheritor of German republicanism, and that the West was dominated by the far right, as shown by its flag. But that's academic, because such adoption was not going to take place.

Makes sense, I'm actually disappointed they didn't go with the Nordic cross design, I've never liked tricolours

 

[Dr. No]

The government most likely not but the President his office and some maybe some federal courts would move to Berlin.
I think it would be awesome if the parliament would meet in the Pauls church were the constitution of 1848 was writen.
I like the symbolic of it.

They wouldn't. The mayor of Frankfurt built a parliament building in advance in order to force Frankfurt as the West German capital. As it didn't succeed, it became the HQ of the Hessischer Rundfunk, the state broadcaster of Hesse. Some federal courts actually were in (West) Berlin during the division and were re-distributed after moving the capital back to Berlin IOTL.

I think there were two other things going on that led to the selection of Bonn. The first was a fear of Frankfurt becoming too dominant and perhaps entrenching itself as a permanent capital. The hope existed, even then, that Berlin would become the capital of a reunified Germany sometime in the future. The second was pretty simple: Bonn was on the other side of the Rhine from the Soviets and in a better strategic position than Frankfurt. There was also a political component: Adenauer's CDU/CSU wanted Bonn and the SPD wanted Frankfurt. Adenauer won that battle.

Bonn was a sleepy place, full of government offices and embassies and little else. It was said that Bonn stood for Bundeshauptstadt ohne nennenswertes Nachtleben. (Federal capital without noteworthy nightlife)!

I have a friend who studied in Bonn and she said that you take the Stadtbahn and party in Cologne. And yes, besides all strategic aspects, having Bonn as a capital made this country more of a petty-bourgeois republic whereas Frankfurt as a big city would've given it a more urban, socia-democratic vibe. And after a major war, and unbombed city is the way to go.

 

[Devvy]

Genuine question...would Germans have accepted Frankfurt as "the" new capital instead of Berlin, as a clean break from Prussian militarism of WWI, and Naziism of WWII (i.e. designed to be a permanent move from day one, instead of a temporary move that inertia keeps there)?

 

[Dathi THorfinnsson]

Just have someone else be first Chancellor instead of Adenauer, and you've got it.

I suspect that moving the capital to Berlin after reunification would be less likely, although as @Anderman [heh, I was going say someone else, it is 'someone else', auf Deutsch] said you might well get some symbolic stuff moved to the 'old capital'.

Given the connexion of Berlin to the militarism of, first Prussia, then Imperial Germany, then Nazi Germany, it might be fairly easy to keep the capital of a united Germany away.