Divide to rule - northern states partition themselves for Senate and EC domination, post Civil War

Reconstruction related what ifs are a popular genre here. Especially more Radical Reconstructions that protect Freedmen's Civil Rights more and punish the south or Confederate elites more.

Sometimes these scenarios, or simply discussions that don't become full blown timelines, involve an embrace of the "State suicide" theory of secession, in order to give Congress, at least temporarily controlled by Radical Republicans, a change to possibly restructure southern states, even their boundaries, in a manner to gerrymander majorities for pro-Union groups like freedmen and upcountry hillbillies.

One undesirable side effect of partition existing southern states is that if the 11 seceded states of the CSA are divided for readmission, and readmitted as more than 11 states, the seceded region would ironically have more relative power in the Senate after rebellion than before.

Keeping that in mind. And keeping Constitutional caution in mind about not dividing states without their consent, what if in the post-Civil War era, Radical Republicans, just Republicans in general, or northerners in general, sought to reinforce northern dominance in representation, prior to readmission of the 11 occupied Confederate states, by subdividing the most populous loyal states, securing two more Senators and Presidential electors for each new state?

I imagine high population states eligible for such division, if their politicians can be convinced to approve of it, would be: Massachusetts, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Illinois, and California.

Certainly, there would be interests opposed to shifting the status quo, but ultimately, more states means more high-ranking jobs for politicians, so it should be easier to agree to than merger of states.
 
Massachusetts
MA and the revival of New Plymouth!

New York east of the Appalachians and Oswego River, "Genesee/Niagara" west of it.

New Jersey
East and West Jersey, natch. East being original NJ so to speak.

Pennsylvania
PA east of the Appalachians of course, "Allegheny/Westsylvania" west of them.

Illinois as we know it was originally settled by upland southerners and Mid-Atlantic-Men, so perhaps "Chicagoland" as the northern third and where all the Yankees live works.

California
Cali in the middle, "Shasta" in the north, and "Colorado" in SoCal.

Seven new states, following the frequent proposals then and now, but also cultural and regional mores then and now. Obviously I know they can be divvied in all sorts of ways, but I wanted to take the really obvious and/or historical ones myself.
 
Reconstruction related what ifs are a popular genre here. Especially more Radical Reconstructions that protect Freedmen's Civil Rights more and punish the south or Confederate elites more.

Sometimes these scenarios, or simply discussions that don't become full blown timelines, involve an embrace of the "State suicide" theory of secession, in order to give Congress, at least temporarily controlled by Radical Republicans, a change to possibly restructure southern states, even their boundaries, in a manner to gerrymander majorities for pro-Union groups like freedmen and upcountry hillbillies.

One undesirable side effect of partition existing southern states is that if the 11 seceded states of the CSA are divided for readmission, and readmitted as more than 11 states, the seceded region would ironically have more relative power in the Senate after rebellion than before.

Keeping that in mind. And keeping Constitutional caution in mind about not dividing states without their consent, what if in the post-Civil War era, Radical Republicans, just Republicans in general, or northerners in general, sought to reinforce northern dominance in representation, prior to readmission of the 11 occupied Confederate states, by subdividing the most populous loyal states, securing two more Senators and Presidential electors for each new state?

I imagine high population states eligible for such division, if their politicians can be convinced to approve of it, would be: Massachusetts, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Illinois, and California.

Certainly, there would be interests opposed to shifting the status quo, but ultimately, more states means more high-ranking jobs for politicians, so it should be easier to agree to than merger of states.
Readmit the former CSA as 1 state lol
 
Maybe Ohio is populous enough to be split into two states as well.

Now splitting northern states is not a surefire guarantee of GOP dominance, as segments of some of the split northern states, like for example, ones consisting of more southern, rural counties of Illinois or Ohio, or dominated by metro New York City or Boston, might have an advantage for the local Democratic Party. Republicans could at least *try* to be competitive in all those areas though, unlike the former Confederacy, by tailoring to local appeals, issues, and norms.

Also, as a matter of Northern sectional power, irrespective of Party, versus Southern sectional power, subdivision in the north and west coast would still strengthen the non-southern sections, with the relative power on non-southerners even within the Democratic Party caucus being strengthened. As it was, the Democrats while relying on Southern Democrats for a core mass of numbers, always needed support outside the region for Congressional or Presidential minorities, and despite yielding to southern preferences on racial matters dear to white southern hearts, they acknowledged their southern base was a handicap nationally by having a taboo on southern nominees from 1868 to 1944. Only nominating a border stater in 1948, after he'd been an accidental incumbent President, an edge case former CSA stater - a Texan, only after he'd been another accidental incumbent President in 1964, and passed innovative Civil Rights legislation, and a Deep South candidate only after the full Civil Rights revolution in 1976, a century after the Civil War.

The Constitutional procedure for permitting a new state to be made from the territory of an existing state required approval of that state, IIRC. Some allege the procedure was trumped up or not kosher in the case of West Virginia. I suppose it *also* requires the usual Congressional approval of the rest of the states, represented in House and Senate by at least simple majority, if not more, to admit that new state, just like any new state admitted from a federal territory or newly annexed land, is that correct?

So, in that manner, northern and western states could form a congressional cabal to deny the southern states, once readmitted or beforehand, attempts to come in as subdivided, multiple states, attempting to acquire more Senators? But that would only be good so long as non-southern regional solidarity held, and partisan motives by Democrats could motivate them to admit what they would think would be additional likely Democratic southern states.
 
Way too much institutional inertia. Such redivisions would be quite costly in administrative disruption and would tread heavily on the interests of most of those prominent in the existing governments. Against these immediate practical considerations, the abstract and distant benefit of increased Senate and electoral numbers would have little force.

BTW - if there had been no ACW, would Virginia ever have been divided? Even before the War, the extent of Virginia was widely recognized as ungainly, and western Virginia was unhappy with rule from Richmond and domination by the Tidewater. And there was the weirdness of "the South" extending to within 150 km of Lake Erie. But the only other state created from part of a state's territory was Maine, which was physically separated from the rest of Massachusetts. That of course didn't apply in Virginia.

So when, if ever, would anything be done?
 
But the only other state created from part of a state's territory was Maine, which was physically separated from the rest of Massachusetts. That of course didn't apply in Virginia.
Ah, Kentucky was created from Virginia just like Maine from Mass, and was contiguous with Virginia, mountains or not. That West Virginia was not happy with Virginia itself I forgot of, though. It would possibly be seen as just a neo-Kentucky situation that finally happened later than it should have.
 
Ah, Kentucky was created from Virginia just like Maine from Mass, and was contiguous with Virginia, mountains or not.
True. Kentucky residents actually voted for one of Virginia's US Representatives in the first two Congresses. Though to be sure the separation of Kentucky from Virginia had been agreed on before the new Constitution was ratified; it was postponed so that it would take place under the new system.
That West Virginia was not happy with Virginia itself I forgot of, though. It would possibly be seen as just a neo-Kentucky situation that finally happened later than it should have.
While theoretically equivalent under law, practically the situations were very different. Kentucky was just barely a functional part of Virginia: almost completely unsettled until. a few years earlier, and only minimally settled by 1788. Western Virginia had been settled and fully included in Virginia for 70 years (as of 1860). There had even been a governor from future West Virginia.

So the "inertia" would be much greater. Could it ever be overcome?
 
I think a more simple, and elegant, solution would be splitting only the Southern states and giving everybody delegates based on population - rounded down.
This way, you obtain a subtle but effective downsizing of the South in electoral terms without having to also divide the North.
 
I think a more simple, and elegant, solution would be splitting only the Southern states and giving everybody delegates based on population - rounded down.
This way, you obtain a subtle but effective downsizing of the South in electoral terms without having to also divide the North.
No, that would have the opposite effect. Creating additional states in the south would create more Senate seats there, and more electoral votes.
 
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