AHC: American territory in Europe

[Doctor Imperialism]

I have to say that the idea of America acquiring land in Europe has always fascinated me. So your challenge, should you choose to accept it, is to have America own some form of land in Europe proper with a POD of 1776.

Bonus points if it has a Med coastline.

More bonus points if this territory becomes a state.

 

[Tallest Skil]

I've always loved this idea.

 

[Elfwine]

I assume OTL military bases don't count.


Why would the US want to own land in Europe? Why would anyone sell land in Europe to the US?

This isn't a "can't be done, end thread" - just that I'm not sure what would motivate it being attempted, let alone successful.

 

[imperialaquila]

Perhaps some occupation zone could be treated as American territory, given time? For example, in some kind of Soviet-overrunning-continental-Europe scenario, you could end up with a residual American occupation zone that is based on the frontlines at the end of the war, not on ethnic or national boundaries. Given lots of US personnel based there to guard against the Soviet threat, this area could potentially end up being treated as a US Commonwealth, like Puerto Rico or the Philippines before independence.

 

[vultan]

American mandate over Constantinople post WWI?

 

[Doctor Imperialism]

I've always loved this idea.

I know, right!? It's like Victoria 2, but better!

I assume OTL military bases don't count.


Why would the US want to own land in Europe? Why would anyone sell land in Europe to the US?

This isn't a "can't be done, end thread" - just that I'm not sure what would motivate it being attempted, let alone successful.

Having strategic land in Europe would allow the US to throw around it's weight even more, or so I would imagine.

Perhaps some occupation zone could be treated as American territory, given time? For example, in some kind of Soviet-overrunning-continental-Europe scenario, you could end up with a residual American occupation zone that is based on the frontlines at the end of the war, not on ethnic or national boundaries. Given lots of US personnel based there to guard against the Soviet threat, this area could potentially end up being treated as a US Commonwealth, like Puerto Rico or the Philippines before independence.

That's a really good idea. Wouldn't last for that long, though, and the US would be occupying it knowing that they would give up the land eventually.

American mandate over Constantinople post WWI?

Yeesh. How on earth could the US get the okay for that from the other powers? I imagine Britain in particular would not be amused.

 

[Elfwine]

Having strategic land in Europe would allow the US to throw around it's weight even more, or so I would imagine.

But up to almost 1900, "throwing its weight around" isn't something the US cares about, at least not except against the natives.

 

[Doctor Imperialism]

But up to almost 1900, "throwing its weight around" isn't something the US cares about, at least not except against the natives.

You have a point. However, there are areas in Europe that I could se the US wanting to acquire even if it is post 1900 - perhaps Gilbraltar in an alternate WW1?

 

[Elfwine]

You have a point. However, there are areas in Europe that I could se the US wanting to acquire even if it is post 1900 - perhaps Gilbraltar in an alternate WW1?

Possibly. You'd need a good POD to get that going, but with "Post 1776", it might be possible - you never gave a limit on when it has to happen by.

I can't think of what would inspire that to be so vital to US interests as to be worth the trouble, though. Ignoring the issue of Britain's feelings, it's a long way from home.

 

[Sicarius]

Anglo/American-Nazi War pulled it off with Western Alaska.

 

[Doctor Imperialism]

Possibly. You'd need a good POD to get that going, but with "Post 1776", it might be possible - you never gave a limit on when it has to happen by.

I can't think of what would inspire that to be so vital to US interests as to be worth the trouble, though. Ignoring the issue of Britain's feelings, it's a long way from home.

Perhaps a convulted form of imperialism wherein the US seeks to acquire holdings in Europe as a way of building its empire? "You have colonies in the Americas, so why can't we have colonies in Europe?"

After all, most colonies were prestige projects and money sinks anyways.

 

[Elfwine]

Perhaps a convulted form of imperialism wherein the US seeks to acquire holdings in Europe as a way of building its empire? "You have colonies in the Americas, so why can't we have colonies in Europe?"

After all, most colonies were prestige projects and money sinks anyways.

1) The Monroe Doctrine, although that can be eliminated or ignored.

2) What European power is going to let the US acquire territory from it back home?

 

[thekingsguard]

The USA spearheads a federation of the other Anglo-American nations, and the federation includes Great Britain and Ireland.

 

[Doctor Imperialism]

1) The Monroe Doctrine, although that can be eliminated or ignored.

2) What European power is going to let the US acquire territory from it back home?

Like I said, perhaps Gilbraltar in a British defeat? Or maybe Sicily, perhaps even in that exact same alt-WW1?

I could see some sort of public call for "comeuppance against the imperialists" and public opinion forcing the government's hand. And depending on how hard Britain/Italy were beaten, I can't see them in a good position to resist.

 

[Doctor Imperialism]

The USA spearheads a federation of the other Anglo-American nations, and the federation includes Great Britain and Ireland.

I don't really think that could really be realistically pulled off - no matter how fuzzy relations get, every Brition is going to be horrified by the idea of their former colony ruling them.

 

[Elfwine]

Like I said, perhaps Gilbraltar in a British defeat? Or maybe Sicily, perhaps even in that exact same alt-WW1?

I could see some sort of public call for "comeuppance against the imperialists" and public opinion forcing the government's hand. And depending on how hard Britain/Italy were beaten, I can't see them in a good position to resist.

Possible, although again, far from home and American interests.

I don't want to say its utterly impossible, but it sounds likely to end badly.

Of course, you just said it had to be owned, not kept.

 

[Revolutionary Avocado]

What about the Azores? In a Portuguese-American War (maybe where the Portuguese enter the Spanish-American War on the Spanish side) the US Navy might capture the Azores to deny Portugal a naval base closer to the United States. While intended to be a temporary occupation, after the collapse of Portugal, the Azores are eventually integrated into the USA as a Commonwealth.

 

[Doctor Imperialism]

Possible, although again, far from home and American interests.

I don't want to say its utterly impossible, but it sounds likely to end badly.

Of course, you just said it had to be owned, not kept.

Come to think of it, a TL where the US has to fight a Vietnam-esque war in a European colony sounds like it could be a fun one to read. I can't think of a place in Europe conductive to guerilla warfare that the US could easily acquire, though.

 

[Grimbald]

What about this?

UK curb stomped in WW1 after US joins CP. No invasion but blockade causes a serious famine.

Ireland rebells against UK.

USA takes Gibralter and Malta in Peace Talks and offers Ireland statehood. Ireland accepts.

ASB probably not, but Earth Bats would be flying.

 

[pieman97405]

Hmm... rather then invade mainland Italy during WW2, the US and Britain invade Sardinia, the Corsica, and eventually Southern France. After successful landings in the south of France, and a drive north to Paris, the US and Britain invade Normandy and drive on Paris from both the north and south, before eventually uniting and turning east towards Germany. Meanwhile, the Soviets focus more on the Balkans, and end up capturing Rome, where they instal a pro-Soviet Government in Italy. After the war, Germany is partitioned like OTL, but mainland Italy falls to Communism. Sicily, rather than join a western puppet kingdom of Italy founded in Sardinia, votes to become a US territory, and in the 1960's or 70's becomes a state.

Ok, that might be slightly ASB.