Like I said, I'm more inclined towards doing map requests for other people than manage my own timeline, atleast in the short-term. I do strongly endorse doing maps and in general trying to incorporate parts of history beyond the military side of things, so those topics will attract me more, like a hungry vulture circling these forums.
A House of Lamps: A Moorish America
- Thread starter dontfearme22
- Start date
Like I said, I'm more inclined towards doing map requests for other people than manage my own timeline, atleast in the short-term. I do strongly endorse doing maps and in general trying to incorporate parts of history beyond the military side of things, so those topics will attract me more, like a hungry vulture circling these forums.
A Dutch colony in the ME is something I have never seen before in any other TL , I applaud you for your originality . I just have two more questions :
1. How did the Ottoman Empire collapse so much quicker than OTL? Is it because of the classic “they expanded too much and imploded” or is there is some other factor to it ?
2. Would TTL ME , Africa and South America be described as more stable than OTL or less
1. Fundamentally yes. The Ottoman empires problems really started as far back as the 1600s. Economic slowdown, internal corruption began to strain the empires finances. Then the Sultan, eager to get into the colonialism and modernization game, began to spend lavishly on expanding the Ottoman imperial presence in Europe and Central Asia. Much of this was only possible because ATL Europe was overall weaker, less developed, and less organized than OTL Europe. The Empire succeeded at first but after a catastrophic Christian revolt in eastern Europe and even more corrosive palace intrigue the pace of decline increased. Also, in incurring many deep debts in trying to fund this expansion, foreign investors began to take advantage of the Ottoman economy. It all went up in smoke after that pretty quickly.
TTL ME, Africa, and South America are all terrible places in different ways. That said, Africa and South America are overall a bit better than OTL because colonialism was marginally less destructive. The ME is much more neglected development-wise due to less global competition over the region...but less massive internationally funded wars also means its more stable.
*heavy breathing*
Well, here goes my Great Wall of Text!
(And you’re welcome! Thank you for making an incredible timeline!)
Americas:
For one. It looks like Andalusia and their colonial possessions went through something akin to what Great Britain or Spain endured IOTL with their empires: revolts, reform, repression, independence, and so on. The parallelisms are interesting to think about. The fact that so many former colonies in Brania (but not Misica, the Ryish, or the Orioles) started out as military dictatorships is also interesting, as it means local infrastructure and social conditions ITTL are inadequate to hold newly-freed states on their own, implying that colonialism down there is a lot more heavy-handed than in the north.
In contrast, their northern neighbours are politically and socially developed enough to hold their own without the army seizing power (or in the Confederacy’s case, politically close enough to their mother country to grow in their own skin), though they haven’t gotten to be good neighbours to each other yet. The emphasis on technological advancement implies R&D being heavily invested amongst many nations – and given the use of robots in warfare, not all for peaceful means. Has Misica or the Orioles pushed for development of nuclear weapons? Their absence is really strange and can imply a number of scenarios.
Africa:
*Madagascar has a colonial empire!*
*Madagascar loses their colonial empire!*
On another note, has there anything done to eradicate or curb the mosquito and tsetse fly? Given the greater tech of this world, I can see something being done about the two buggers which can be a blessing to millions. Then again, the disparity of wealth in the continent might prevent that. Also, what is the difference between Kongo and Free Kongo? And how Islamic is the Luba Islamic Republic? I can see all three nations haranguing each other for water rights in the basin, given they all share the Kongo River system. Besides that, how did Buganda and the Great Lakes got colonized by the Dutch?
Asia:
HOLY CRAP IS THAT ONE FUNKY CHINA. I’m guessing the Manchus are knocked-off from history and the Mongols see themselves as part of the greater Zungar/Turkic horse-nomad group? Given the shape and geography of the region, I guess this China has three different geo-ethno-cultural polestars: the Tibetan Plateau, the Han Chinese core and the Amur north. Man, I want to see how the cultural mixing will play out.
Moving to the south, Namviet is an… odd name, but languages can drift so eh. And seeing how the mountainous parts of Indochina are parcelled out, I’m guessing there’s some tensions between the local mountainfolks and the nations they’re a part of – independent tribes often care little for national borders or hierarchical state power. Are there any states there that have some kind of federalism and autonomy for their minorities? Or do they try to make the hill tribes assimilate into their society? Thailand and Myanman in particular will be burned a lot with this problem, if the maps are to be believed. I wonder why the Thai capital is at Kruth Koi instead of Bangkok (psst: the locals call it Krung Thep)? For strategic purposes?
And finally, Nusantara. I didn’t spot this early on, but some place names in Nusantara should be different here in account of their alternate histories (Banda Aceh should be called Kutaraja, Putrujaya should be Prang Besar, and so on). But again, language drifts, so eh. I am surprised at Brunei not holding northern Borneo/Sabah, especially when the colonial map shows the region being uncolonized by any European power. Given how France colonized the Philippines, I guess they also subsumed the sultanates of Sulu and Maguindanao, which would leave Sabah wide open for Bruneian control. The locals must’ve really liked the Jawi Republics then.
That’s all I have for now, though I’ll probably make some more Walls of Text later on, rereading this. What an update, and what a conclusion to this timeline!
Well, here goes my Great Wall of Text!
(And you’re welcome! Thank you for making an incredible timeline!)
Americas:
For one. It looks like Andalusia and their colonial possessions went through something akin to what Great Britain or Spain endured IOTL with their empires: revolts, reform, repression, independence, and so on. The parallelisms are interesting to think about. The fact that so many former colonies in Brania (but not Misica, the Ryish, or the Orioles) started out as military dictatorships is also interesting, as it means local infrastructure and social conditions ITTL are inadequate to hold newly-freed states on their own, implying that colonialism down there is a lot more heavy-handed than in the north.
In contrast, their northern neighbours are politically and socially developed enough to hold their own without the army seizing power (or in the Confederacy’s case, politically close enough to their mother country to grow in their own skin), though they haven’t gotten to be good neighbours to each other yet. The emphasis on technological advancement implies R&D being heavily invested amongst many nations – and given the use of robots in warfare, not all for peaceful means. Has Misica or the Orioles pushed for development of nuclear weapons? Their absence is really strange and can imply a number of scenarios.
Africa:
*Madagascar has a colonial empire!*
*Madagascar loses their colonial empire!*
On another note, has there anything done to eradicate or curb the mosquito and tsetse fly? Given the greater tech of this world, I can see something being done about the two buggers which can be a blessing to millions. Then again, the disparity of wealth in the continent might prevent that. Also, what is the difference between Kongo and Free Kongo? And how Islamic is the Luba Islamic Republic? I can see all three nations haranguing each other for water rights in the basin, given they all share the Kongo River system. Besides that, how did Buganda and the Great Lakes got colonized by the Dutch?
Asia:
HOLY CRAP IS THAT ONE FUNKY CHINA. I’m guessing the Manchus are knocked-off from history and the Mongols see themselves as part of the greater Zungar/Turkic horse-nomad group? Given the shape and geography of the region, I guess this China has three different geo-ethno-cultural polestars: the Tibetan Plateau, the Han Chinese core and the Amur north. Man, I want to see how the cultural mixing will play out.
Moving to the south, Namviet is an… odd name, but languages can drift so eh. And seeing how the mountainous parts of Indochina are parcelled out, I’m guessing there’s some tensions between the local mountainfolks and the nations they’re a part of – independent tribes often care little for national borders or hierarchical state power. Are there any states there that have some kind of federalism and autonomy for their minorities? Or do they try to make the hill tribes assimilate into their society? Thailand and Myanman in particular will be burned a lot with this problem, if the maps are to be believed. I wonder why the Thai capital is at Kruth Koi instead of Bangkok (psst: the locals call it Krung Thep)? For strategic purposes?
And finally, Nusantara. I didn’t spot this early on, but some place names in Nusantara should be different here in account of their alternate histories (Banda Aceh should be called Kutaraja, Putrujaya should be Prang Besar, and so on). But again, language drifts, so eh. I am surprised at Brunei not holding northern Borneo/Sabah, especially when the colonial map shows the region being uncolonized by any European power. Given how France colonized the Philippines, I guess they also subsumed the sultanates of Sulu and Maguindanao, which would leave Sabah wide open for Bruneian control. The locals must’ve really liked the Jawi Republics then.
That’s all I have for now, though I’ll probably make some more Walls of Text later on, rereading this. What an update, and what a conclusion to this timeline!
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*heavy breathing*
Well, here goes my Great Wall of Text!
(And you’re welcome! Thank you for making an incredible timeline!)
Americas:
For one. It looks like Andalusia and their colonial possessions went through something akin to what Great Britain or Spain endured IOTL with their empires: revolts, reform, repression, independence, and so on. The parallelisms are interesting to think about. The fact that so many former colonies in Brania (but not Misica, the Ryish, or the Orioles) started out as military dictatorships is also interesting, as it means local infrastructure and social conditions ITTL are inadequate to hold newly-freed states on their own, implying that colonialism down there is a lot more heavy-handed than in the north.
In contrast, their northern neighbours are politically and socially developed enough to hold their own without the army seizing power (or in the Confederacy’s case, politically close enough to their mother country to grow in their own skin), though they haven’t gotten to be good neighbours to each other yet. The emphasis on technological advancement implies R&D being heavily invested amongst many nations – and given the use of robots in warfare, not all for peaceful means. Has Misica or the Orioles pushed for development of nuclear weapons? Their absence is really strange and can imply a number of scenarios.
Africa:
*Madagascar has a colonial empire!*
*Madagascar loses their colonial empire!*
On another note, has there anything done to eradicate or curb the mosquito and tsetse fly? Given the greater tech of this world, I can see something being done about the two buggers which can be a blessing to millions. Then again, the disparity of wealth in the continent might prevent that. Also, what is the difference between Kongo and Free Kongo? And how Islamic is the Luba Islamic Republic? I can see all three nations haranguing each other for water rights in the basin, given they all share the Kongo River system. Besides that, how did Buganda and the Great Lakes got colonized by the Dutch?
Asia:
HOLY CRAP IS THAT ONE FUNKY CHINA. I’m guessing the Manchus are knocked-off from history and the Mongols see themselves as part of the greater Zungar/Turkic horse-nomad group? Given the shape and geography of the region, I guess this China has three different geo-ethno-cultural polestars: the Tibetan Plateau, the Han Chinese core and the Amur north. Man, I want to see how the cultural mixing will play out.
Moving to the south, Namviet is an… odd name, but languages can drift so eh. And seeing how the mountainous parts of Indochina are parcelled out, I’m guessing there’s some tensions between the local mountainfolks and the nations they’re a part of – independent tribes often care little for national borders or hierarchical state power. Are there any states there that have some kind of federalism and autonomy for their minorities? Or do they try to make the hill tribes assimilate into their society? Thailand and Myanman in particular will be burned a lot with this problem, if the maps are to be believed. I wonder why the Thai capital is at Kruth Koi instead of Bangkok (psst: the locals call it Krung Thep)? For strategic purposes?
And finally, Nusantara. I didn’t spot this early on, but some place names in Nusantara should be different here in account of their alternate histories (Banda Aceh should be called Kutaraja, Putrujaya should be Prang Besar, and so on). But again, language drifts, so eh. I am surprised at Brunei not holding northern Borneo/Sabah, especially when the colonial map shows the region being uncolonized by any European power. Given how France colonized the Philippines, I guess they also subsumed the sultanates of Sulu and Maguindanao, which would leave Sabah wide open for Bruneian control. The locals must’ve really liked the Jawi Republics then.
That’s all I have for now, though I’ll probably make some more Walls of Text later on, rereading this. What an update, and what a conclusion to this timeline!
Yes theres so many cities I had to rename that some slipped through the cracks, like Livingstone in Zambia or Savannah, Georgia (urgh). I was on a tight schedule and QA trailed off a bit sadly. Thanks for pointing it out however. I will say, Nam Viet is actually one of the historical names of Vietnam, thats intentionally weird lol.
Getting to your other points, atomic technology does not develop in this timeline much at all compared to OTL. The greatest mass weapons of war are autonomous weapons platforms. Misica and the C.O.S are both developed, large, technologically advanced states but recent conflict in the western deserts has pushed both to explore alternative weapons technologies, especially after military robots were banned. You are likely to see more emphasis on human-guided machines that use a lot of advanced technology but skirt the regulations just barely. Railguns are probably pound for pound the most destructive weapons ATL.
Africa
Free Kongo is called so because it is part of the historical Kongo region but was never conquered by the Arab vassals under the Sise. Instead, it retained general autonomy with a nominal Arab claim until its development into a modern parliamentary state. Originally both states, the partitioned state Kongo, and the actual main heir of the Kingdom of Kongo, both were called Kongo. Free was added shortly after the former nations founding to distinguish the two.
The Luba Islamic Republic has a muslim plurality and Islam is enshrined in government. Much of central Africa was islamized ATL. The Luba states were targeted also as a useful buffer against colonial pressures from the east and so there was more effort made to assimilate them. Currently they have a deep rivalry with Free Kongo, and associate more closely with Kongo proper. Free Kongo alternatively has been trending towards the more Christianized nations to its south more and more, including asking for Dutch support in fighting rebels in the nearby Coast Kwanza state, which declared war against them in the 90s.
On Asia. Yes, the Manchus never succeeded in conquering mainland China, but the Mongols *definitely* dont see themselves as part of the Zungar Turkic state. Zungaristan developed as a loose confederacy united in the 19th century under Turkic warlords who then solidified their territory with Russian support. The idea being to have a buffer state that was easily controlled between Russia and then expanding French ambitions in mainland China. After Chinese independence, there was little will to conquer the large frontier region, since it still served as a useful frontier against a still very imperialist, hostile Russia, and because the young Republic was chronically bankrupt, barely able to hold its current territories together.
That said, the region has a very large Mongol presence, and the Mongols have fought several uprisings against the Turkic government, all unsuccessful. Currently the Mongol and Han dominated regions enjoy a sort of autonomy like OTL Kurdistan. Much of southern Zungaristan is contested by China on the basis of there being a deep historic Han Chinese connection to that region.
SE Asia
The new Thai capital is entirely a strategic decision to put the administrative center closer to the center of the country. For many OTL cities that are basically the same ATL, I kept their colloquial English names. The map is in English, and you can see for many cities in the New World for instance that they have anglicized names where the originals would be different.
Many of the smaller states in the hill regions of South Asia are chronically under-developed, formed by small independence movements that splintered out of the larger historic Indian, Chinese, Vietnamese, and Thai empires as those empires all declined in the last 200 years. Dayiland (its English name) especially is one of the least developed states in the world. Alternatively, ATL Myanman is a more stable, democratic state than OTL with decent protection for ethnic minorities in its borders.
The Jawi Republics were the epicenter of a charismatic independence movement that transcended religious, ethnic, or linguistic divisions in favor of a unified Nusantaran identity. Brunei and Medan both were regions with seperatist holdouts (Medan in particular had a stronger loyalty to its colonial rulers) and so rejected offers to join the Republics. Alternatively, in Sabah local, independent rulers did choose the Republics. Brunei lost control of much of its farther flung territories after being on the losing end of wars against rulers who had greater foreign backing.
Thanks for being such a enthusiastic follower of the timeline. My only regret always with contributing here was that I couldn't ever put in as much effort as the fascinating setting deserved.
@dontfearme22
Glad to see an andalusi TL finished. Some questions:
- could you maybe post a religious map?
- Are there any space programms and how advanced are they? Any space-stations or colonies?
- You mentioned robots in the 1940s. Are these mechs or independent units? Have WMDs been used?
- How is Germany doing?
Glad to see an andalusi TL finished. Some questions:
- could you maybe post a religious map?
- Are there any space programms and how advanced are they? Any space-stations or colonies?
- You mentioned robots in the 1940s. Are these mechs or independent units? Have WMDs been used?
- How is Germany doing?
No time for any new maps for the time being unfortunately, but all of the OTL Southwest through Mexico into Northern Brazil and then down all the way through Argentina are muslim. The eastern portion of South America, eastern North America, Canada and the Pacific Northwest are Christian. Africa is 2/3rds muslim either fully or partially with Christianity concentrated in the east and far south.
There are space programs going back to about the 40s. Since rocket technology and electronics are more advanced than our timeline there is a bit more progress in extraterrestrial flight. Most space exploration is pioneered by New World states like Barnugua, Misica, and the C.O.S focusing on autonomous exploration of other planetary bodies. This timeline had no treaties banning military exploitation of space, and before their banning orbital weapons platforms had been deployed by France when fighting the Western War. If you cant guess already, that war was bad. really bad. These would be the closest to WMDs in this timeline.
Speaking of the Western War, it was a big catalyst for the banning of military robots ~20 years later as the real effects of that sort of destruction were digested by the global community. You saw flying drones, wheeled drones, larger wheeled weapons platforms, but no giant gundam-like mechs. You saw some walking mechs that were more 4-legged / 6-legged designs however. One reason Misica won the war instead of France was the development of specific strategies to combat autonomous weapons by human soldiers, including disrupting sensors, sabotaging communications and exploiting flaws in the robots quasi-AI. Frances widespread use of combat robots on the frontline, and especially in 'pacifying' seditious areas led to a series of high-profile war crimes that turned global civilian opinion against such weapons use in war. To everyones utter surprise, a machine doesn't have any ethical problems firing into a crowd.
There are no permanent human space colonies, but there is a Mars colony of relative size home to a scientific population.
Germany got the short end of the stick from the larger European peace of the last century. Its economy crashed hard in the early 1900s and it has had a difficult time recovering. Internal political unrest led to on and off sectarian violence that even today has stagnated development in much of the country.
@dontfearme22 Info how is the region are otl countries of colombia,venezuela, panama and carribeans island at th end of the story?
Heck, this was a great finale! We have combat robots (Which to the utter surprise of everyone backfired horribly).
Well, i wonder how is the ethnic composition of Virginia-Covnan, is it like OTL Brazil? With the majority being a highly mixed population and such? Or has a clearly separation between the white and black communities?
Another thing, Tuvuland seems to be sparsely populated, something like the OTL Boers (but mixed with the native xavantes, what makes a culture that i really can't imagine how would be), if i not wrong, i think that in the Branian states, post-colonial european migration may have some great impact on the settlement, how are localized the strongest foreign communities? (Berbers in the pampas plsssssssssssssss)
Also, how are fairing the native americans? By what was stated, the mayans went through all the colonization stuff pretty well (at least as a distinct culture), i wonder how it went for the others in Misica (Nahua, Otomi, Tarascans and such). The same questions applies to the rest of the continent, in the Andes Quechua may have an even greater influence, thanks to the lasting Inca influence by the successor states, tough i want to know how the Mapuche faired in this world.
In General, i loved TTL and tough sad that it is ending, we can say huzzah to the timeline being, at least, finished.
Y'know, you're completely in my wishlist for mapmaking
Well, i wonder how is the ethnic composition of Virginia-Covnan, is it like OTL Brazil? With the majority being a highly mixed population and such? Or has a clearly separation between the white and black communities?
Another thing, Tuvuland seems to be sparsely populated, something like the OTL Boers (but mixed with the native xavantes, what makes a culture that i really can't imagine how would be), if i not wrong, i think that in the Branian states, post-colonial european migration may have some great impact on the settlement, how are localized the strongest foreign communities? (Berbers in the pampas plsssssssssssssss)
Also, how are fairing the native americans? By what was stated, the mayans went through all the colonization stuff pretty well (at least as a distinct culture), i wonder how it went for the others in Misica (Nahua, Otomi, Tarascans and such). The same questions applies to the rest of the continent, in the Andes Quechua may have an even greater influence, thanks to the lasting Inca influence by the successor states, tough i want to know how the Mapuche faired in this world.
In General, i loved TTL and tough sad that it is ending, we can say huzzah to the timeline being, at least, finished.
Y'know, you're completely in my wishlist for mapmaking
OTL Colombia, Venezuela, Panama and the Caribbean are all quite different places ATL. Colombia, Venezuela, and Panama are all divided between post-colonial Arab states. While Colombia and Panama are 3 seperate states, Venezuela is absorbed inside a larger state that includes the OTL Guineas, Abrania. Abrania is the most developed, prosperous, state on the northern end of S. America while Macasar, Marauia, and Rorzoro (ATL states including Colombia and Panama) are various degrees of high poverty, inequality and political strife.
The Caribbean is all united under a single Rishi Republic, a powerful island nation almost like modern OTL Indonesia. It is (compared to Indonesia) however, less ethnically diverse. The Rishi Republic is a semi-democratic state that is really more of a oligarchy with a few powerful political dynasties trading places each election.
Slovaustria (Austrenia?) was the result of the Ottoman invasions into central and northern Europe during 1700s. The collapse of the Hapsburg dynasty in Austria - yes that one - saw the nation dissolve into minor principalities unable to resist Ottoman conquest. During the occupation, the entire region was administered as a single vilayet. Slovenia on the other hand, retained independent coastal pockets under the rule of some stubborn lords in the area. These pockets became footholds to recapture the entire region of Inner Austria and Austria proper, but because much of Germanic Austria was either violently depopulated or saw large refugee outflow, the newly independent Austrian League encouraged peasants from the south to settle in the area to replenish it. The entire region fell under the unified control of the catholic Counts of Fejer in the 1800s who also incorporated their Hungarian holdings into the empire. This state lasted relatively unscathed until the modern era.
In short: The Ottomans expanded much more successfully across Europe ATL. One effect of this was obliterating the political power of Austria while leaving Slovenia more intact. In the aftermath, Slavic culture began to dominate across much of formerly German Austria and eventually the region came under German-speaking rulership but with a strong Slavic plurality across much of the nation. Years later Hungarian-speaking lords married into the state and expanded it, taking it over and establishing its general modern borders. Modern Slovenia is majority Slavic Slovenes, with a large German minority in the northwest. It is governed as a parliamentary democracy with the current general share of power still vested in ethnic Germans. The modern name was chosen to appease the Slavs and is not too popular elsewhere (for obvious reasons).
Heck, this was a great finale! We have combat robots (Which to the utter surprise of everyone backfired horribly).
Well, i wonder how is the ethnic composition of Virginia-Covnan, is it like OTL Brazil? With the majority being a highly mixed population and such? Or has a clearly separation between the white and black communities?
Another thing, Tuvuland seems to be sparsely populated, something like the OTL Boers (but mixed with the native xavantes, what makes a culture that i really can't imagine how would be), if i not wrong, i think that in the Branian states, post-colonial european migration may have some great impact on the settlement, how are localized the strongest foreign communities? (Berbers in the pampas plsssssssssssssss)
Also, how are fairing the native americans? By what was stated, the mayans went through all the colonization stuff pretty well (at least as a distinct culture), i wonder how it went for the others in Misica (Nahua, Otomi, Tarascans and such). The same questions applies to the rest of the continent, in the Andes Quechua may have an even greater influence, thanks to the lasting Inca influence by the successor states, tough i want to know how the Mapuche faired in this world.
In General, i loved TTL and tough sad that it is ending, we can say huzzah to the timeline being, at least, finished.
Y'know, you're completely in my wishlist for mapmaking
hmu fam for map stuff
Covnan is a lot like a modern OTL Caribbean country. The majority of the population today is biracial leaning towards a stronger African influence, with large immigrant and mestizo populations. One reason Covnan took so long to free itself of foreign rule was the overwhelming political dominance of coastal white settlers where in other English colonies integration had happened earlier and more thoroughly. In Covnan, the major cities were a white majority with the rest of the people living in the countryside. After independence many of these white English settlers fled to either Europe or other nearby nations. Urbanization has dramatically shifted the overall ethnic mixture in the cities.
All of central Brazil south through Argentina is governed by states built on the migration of the Sharuan Arabs, who are much like Boers in overall culture and attitude. There are no Pampas Berber guanchos but there are lots of Arab ones.
The Sharuans are almost like OTL Metis. They are a blend of isolated Arab settlements and local Amerindians, speaking a creole language between Rishi Arabic and primarily Guarani. Much of their historical lifestyle revolved around pastoralism which aided them when they began to migrate outwards over the last 250 years. Sharuans dominated the vast tracts of S. America for decades. As more European immigrants settled the interior they came into conflict with local Sharuan groups.
In Tuvuland, you saw a lot of Dutch, Frisian, German and Scandinavian immigration. These immigrants successfully settled in the region despite attempts of local Amerindians and Sharuans to displace them. The modern nation of Tuvuland is now a majority of primarily European descent, who speak German with a Dutch minority. The west is still overwhelmingly Sharuan, Arab speaking with even a Castillian settlement in the far south. The Tuvulanders united into a single state to oppose the English-speaking east and protect from raids from violent peoples in the south and west.
Native Americans still got rekted, but less rekted than OTL. The Maya islamized and Arabized rapidly in the Yucatan but retain more native traditions in the southern highlands. The Misica were wiped out as a distinctive group. Pacification campaigns in the 1800s which saw the ethnically united Misica encouraged assimiliation into broader society and outright banned many indigenous groups. That said the Totonac language, being the language of many native administrators spread throughout the empire was widely adopted in the south and west of Misica and there remains a healthy speaking community - albeit the actual indigenous themselves are almost extinct. Modern ATL Misica is primarily mestizo Arabs, Arabic speaking, and muslim.
The Inca were gone before Arabs even arrived. The successor states similarily, were destroyed one by one. Quechua is used much less frequently ATL over other indigenous languages.
As for the ever-overlooked Mapuche, they co-existed with Sharuan Arabs for over 150 years that saw the Mapuche gradually integrated through intermarriage. The true Mapuche heritage is still strong in the northwestern portion of the South Arab States. Indeed, this region maintained its independence fiercly before a brutal war of conquest brought it under control in the late 1800s.
Native Americans survived best in western North America. You saw a much higher level of political development ATL, with large Native nations establishing themselves in the interior. Despite many attempts to conquer the region Christian Europeans always failed, and Arabs never settled in great number across the area. The biggest factor driving this was the delayed timeline of colonization, which gave disease more time to first ravage native populations, but then also for those survivors to recover.
Today the N. American interior is divided between a few states of mixed Native / Arab / European populations that exist mostly to act as buffers between more powerful hostile nations on the coasts. Politically Ayowadda and Sietun are like OTL Mongolia. They're insurance against the other guys armies.
Castille was going through rough, rough times by the time Arab armies marched in. Castille was formally annexed in 1754. Before then, it had, in the late 1600s, endured a destructive protestant revolt against Catholic Valoisian rule. Then, in 1720 the Union dissolved and Castille immediately descended into a second revolt, this time between the Catholic crown and protestant rebels who felt jilted by the whole ordeal.
By the time the Grand Cape War broke out, Castille was deep in debt to hold its overseas territories, with the wealth coming from those colonies being embezzled by a corrupt bureaucracy, stolen by pirates, or not coming at all due to local mismanagement. The War saw Castillian armies get destroyed by the Arabs. Eventually Castille sold much of its colonial empire to France in exchange for money and military aid. Arab armies, hoping to invade France directly marched through Castille and the then-independent state of Gascony, conquering both and unsuccessfully invading France. The end terms of the war ceded massive territories in the New World to France but allowed Andalusia to keep its Iberian and Gascon holdings, which were both seen as bankrupt backwaters too expensive to control anyways.
A big reason the Arabs were able to conquer large Christian regions like these were that the local populations were generally more inclined towards lenient Arab rule over the strict Christian rule of years past. Especially in Castille local Protestants who controlled much of the land hated the Catholic lords the Arabs displaced, and local Catholics were too busy not dying to put up significant resistance. Many Protestants honestly preferred Muslim rule to Catholic.
Gascony was a bit different. The independent state was popular among its inhabitants, but it was not even close to a match to the full might of the Arab empire. Gascony was taken over only because the Arabs brutally suppressed revolt, maintained control over urban areas, and nobody else was willing to intervene. The overall conquest of northern Iberia was a great drain of Arab resources and contributed to many of that empires later financial problems, and then even later its inability to keep its colonies from breaking away.
Today northern Iberia has a large Christian population that is allowed to worship freely, speaking their local languages (Galician, Normano, Cantabrian, Basque etc.) and elect local leaders. However, Arabs still control much of the seats of power. Many Christians commonly protest and advocate for greater autonomy. Gascony has it worse, where armed terrorist movements have stifled attempts by peaceful advocates to achieve more freedoms.
@dontfearme22 Did you write an Encyclopedia for this TL? Again, great TL!
What about the north africans? Is Morocco a federation and how is the situation between arabs and the various amazigh groups?
Again, great TL!What about the north africans? Is Morocco a federation and how is the situation between arabs and the various amazigh groups?
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Ah shoot, all the questions I want to ask are already taken.
Hmm... which nations are the most economically powerful? And which nations score the highest in quality of life?
Hmm... which nations are the most economically powerful? And which nations score the highest in quality of life?
No, nukes were never invented. Atomic technology in general is a niche field seen as having little potential among broader scientists. There is a understanding of radiation, but its utility is not widely appreciated.
The most destructive weapons used in the Western War were autonomous weapons platforms anchored in orbit. France deployed the Lion and Tonnerre platforms, satellites mounted with railguns. Misica in turn deployed a swarm of smaller satellites designed to overwhelm the larger French space fleet. Both sides fought a autonomous war in orbit at the same time they were fighting in the atmosphere with planes and on the ground. Because much of the Western War was fought by guerillas on the ground these groups had little defense against space-borne weaponry. After a series of crushing strikes by the French platforms the Misicans ended up losing a lot of hard-fought gains on the ground. The platforms were eventually incapacitated by technical problems and grounded in favor of smaller vehicles.
Space-borne weapons platforms still exist but are highly controversial, and heavily regulated.
@dontfearme22 Did you write an Encyclopedia for this TL?
What about the north africans? Is Morocco a federation and how is the situation between arabs and the various amazigh groups?
Morocco is, complicated. It gained its independence from Iberia during a violent uprising. Moroccan rebel fighters faced air strikes, armored vehicles, automatic weapons, and even flamethrowers as the revolt spread from its origins in the Rif to the entire region. Eventually the Iberian parliament forced the 'prime minister' (to use the English term) Abu Sadh to withdraw. Full independence came soon after. The war had simply become too expensive. It left northern Morocco devastated, but free (under a coalition of different ethnic militias). These militias reached a power-sharing agreement that exchanged government between the different ethnicities in the nation every 3 years (later changed to 5). This last for a decade before a military dictatorship under Arab rule started. This dictatorship built its wealth on extracting minerals from its borders. The ATL province of Morocco that seceded matched the modern nations borders, so you can see that it includes quite a lot of territory that is not historically 'Moroccan'. This large desert area was only used for mining, with the large desert wastes nearby under the effective control of wandering tribes. The Moroccan Army spent a lot of time subjugating the territory. Part of this was driving out bandits (aka. tribesmen unwilling to swear fealty) and another part was 'convincing' local Arab settlers in the mining towns to participate in the new state.
After the dictatorship non-Arab political parties unified in a broad coalition that lasts to this day as the dominant opposition party. There were many years of retaliatory measures against Arabs of which some are still in effect today. The Rif remains as a perennial source of discontent, and the groups in the far south.
Sorry for skipping your comment. Misica, the C.O.S, China / India, Russia, Barnugua, and Kongo are probably some of the largest global economic players. Western Europe is as always hard to beat, but Misica, the Rishi Republic, the C.O.S and the eastern shore of S. America are all very developed, generally safe places. Similarily parts of (but definitely not most of) Kongo, India, and parts of China. East Asia and the Mideast is in general not as developed in this timeline while the Americas and west Africa are more developed - as in quality of life.
Korea for example, is much more rural, much poorer, and much less powerful in this timeline. Also Japan (b-baka).
It is a very fascinating TL already. Lot of things are quite original. You don't see these kind of TLs every day.
On unrelated note, what happened to Salafism AKA Wahhabism ITL? I doubt Colonial Middle-East will be peaceful because of colonial rule.
On unrelated note, what happened to Salafism AKA Wahhabism ITL? I doubt Colonial Middle-East will be peaceful because of colonial rule.
Salafism is not Wahhabism, calling that is like calling a Religious Marxist is the same to a facist...