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  1. Warthog

    No Scramble for Africa - State System

    Interesting question. The grossly oversimplified summary in Southern Africa is that most states were less interested in direct control of territory than in control of trade. So a surviving Rozvi Kingdom, for example, would have maintained a watchful peace with occasionally clashes vs...
  2. Warthog

    WI: Elon Musk remains in South Africa

    No, not by any normal definition. There are problems, but government bureaucracies function, utilities are on, schools are open etc etc
  3. Warthog

    WI: Elon Musk remains in South Africa

    A lot of overlap with this thread There's the military service matter, delaying university until he was 20, so he'd have been at university at the dawn of democracy, and looking for his first job during the Mandela administration. He could have started with one of the telecoms, or Denel or...
  4. Warthog

    AHC: Apartheid South Africa survives into the 21st Century

    The conflicts are not so comparable, starting with the differences in ethnic/racial demographics. Not only is oppressing a majority much harder than oppressing a population of similar size, but over time "your own" businessmen start thinking they'd make more money if "the other side" had more...
  5. Warthog

    Looking for South Africa-centric Timelines/ISOTs

    I've seen a couple of timelines* where the Nats don't win the '48 election, and things don't get as bad as OTL. *not on this platform This crops up every 6 months or so as a scenario / challenge, but haven't seen anyone do a proper timeline. It is there as part of the backstory to John...
  6. Warthog

    AHC: Apartheid South Africa survives into the 21st Century

    Who, Heunis? The Jagged Orbit by John Brunner 🤔
  7. Warthog

    AHC: Apartheid South Africa survives into the 21st Century

    Writing was already on the wall for the end of apartheid: the Dakar Dialogue had happened, and follow up talks were happening by the time PW died. PW had already met Mandela in 89. Heunis was very much part of PW's attempts at minor reforms, and had some limited contact with ANC. He wasn't an...
  8. Warthog

    Pearl Harbor never becomes a major Naval base?

    Where does this conspiracy theory come from? Is this a recent thing on par with more recent false flag lunacy, or has it been around? I'd never read such lunacy (on FDR) before??
  9. Warthog

    Could Rhodesia-Nyasaland stay together?

    I think it takes more than that: the Federation was largely a UFP creation, and the Prime Ministers were UFP. So the African nationalist opposition was very much directed at the UFP government in Salisbury. Northern Rhodesia and Nyasaland weren't equal partners, with the initial suggestion of...
  10. Warthog

    What if Nelson Mandela had died in the 1980s?

    Yes but extrapolating from something which specifically didn't happen, to predict what might happen is confusing, especially as it isn't a thing among South Africans, who'd be the ones doing the rioting (or not)
  11. Warthog

    What if Nelson Mandela had died in the 1980s?

    Sorry, what? That didn't happen. It's recent history, you can watch the newsclips etc.
  12. Warthog

    What if Nelson Mandela had died in the 1980s?

    Thing is, Mandela wasn't a moderate. He was a founder of the armed struggle, and when P.W. Botha offered him release from prison if he renounced violence (1985) he refused. The armed struggle wasn't suspended until 1990. And by the time Mandela was meeting with government officials to start...
  13. Warthog

    What if Nelson Mandela had died in the 1980s?

    Nelson Mandela was very popular, then and now, as a symbol of the struggle (in addition to the reputation he developed after his release). However, it is easy to overestimate his role in the early to mid 80s, given the monumental role he later had. Mandela's involvement in negotiations with the...
  14. Warthog

    AHC: Apartheid South Africa survives into the 21st Century

    Ah. This idea is back. Link to the thread from just over a year ago
  15. Warthog

    South Africa: Part of the Axis of Evil. How would George W Bush deal with Apartheid South Africa?

    Fruit and nut department
  16. Warthog

    South Africa: Part of the Axis of Evil. How would George W Bush deal with Apartheid South Africa?

    That's a fairly wild conspiracy 😜 My understanding too, especially in Boputhatswana. It would have needed to be on a hugely greater scale though.
  17. Warthog

    South Africa: Part of the Axis of Evil. How would George W Bush deal with Apartheid South Africa?

    Except Verwoerd wouldn't do larger Bantustans, giving up white farmland to blacks?
  18. Warthog

    Blue Skies in Camelot (Continued): An Alternate 80s and Beyond

    What changed that gave Muzorewa a majority compared to the 3% he got OTL?
  19. Warthog

    How to save these African states?

    Malê Rising is worth reading (very very worth reading anyway) but is relevant in this context
  20. Warthog

    Which colonial power "improved" their colonies the most?

    This is, without question, the fundamental answer to the OP. "Improvement" or "leaving better" is meaningless in the context of historic progress and denies agency to those communities colonized in OTL.
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